Caspar Lee
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Re: Caspar Lee
I am not saying youtubers are the worst people in history I am saying that they are not exempt from criticism and seem to be happy to point out other peoples flaws in other industries
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Re: Caspar Lee
Yeah the million at 21 shocked me too. Had he even done on the road at the point ? How old is he now ? Caspar was never really obnoxious with loads of crappy books and merch so it's crazy to imagine how much his less modest contemporaries made... I guess this was pre adpocalypse and now that wouldn't be possible ? What a goldmine YouTube was for those lucky enough to have a bit of an audience circa 2010-2016 though.
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Re: Caspar Lee
I honestly don't get how anything Zoe has ever sold is any different than band merch or a celebrity endorsed/branded beauty product. I agree the calendar was far too pricey but I also don't believe that was entirely, if at all her fault. And it's also pretty shitty that people just assume she doesn't donate to charity. I know she at least donates most of the free things she gets (which is a lot already) and I'm sure she's helped out charities as well. Not sure if it's the same in the UK as America but a lot of wealthy people get involved with charities because if they donate a certain amount they don't have to pay taxes. So instead of the money going to the government, it goes to a good charity.
I was surprised Caspar admitted to being a millionaire. It's nice that he was being honest about it without coming off as arrogant but just surprising he said it since most people (not just YouTubers) tend to not discuss money. I kind of wish he went more into depth about everything he was talking about, the video seemed a little short. I'm liking the direction his channel is going in though. I think it would be really beneficial and interesting if he did a video discussing the same sort of topics he did in this one and the interview he did with Joe but with Zoe or Alfie instead. I feel like Zoe would be more willing to get more deep and personal and a bit more raw than Alfie would.
I was surprised Caspar admitted to being a millionaire. It's nice that he was being honest about it without coming off as arrogant but just surprising he said it since most people (not just YouTubers) tend to not discuss money. I kind of wish he went more into depth about everything he was talking about, the video seemed a little short. I'm liking the direction his channel is going in though. I think it would be really beneficial and interesting if he did a video discussing the same sort of topics he did in this one and the interview he did with Joe but with Zoe or Alfie instead. I feel like Zoe would be more willing to get more deep and personal and a bit more raw than Alfie would.
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Re: Caspar Lee
Honestly BONTBFW, you explained 'their side of things' better than Caspar did. His video was basically this vague rant about 'positivity, positivity, I know Zoe personally and I think she's great so you shouldn't say bad things about her merch because it's not nice, media doesn't get youtube, put yourselfves in our shoes, people change, more positivity.' without actually addressing anything in particular. Yes, it's not what I wanted to hear, it's basically just another version of the same 'Mainstream media and the rest of the world doesn't get that youtube is the new ReALiTy' that I've been hearing since 2014.
I don't think Zoe is a 'horrible person' lol but this is not the first time Zoe has been accused of selling pricey merch. do we really have to pretend that youtubers just sit around while mysterious people around them sell ridiculously overpriced merch under their names and make profit of it? Of course youtubers can control the prices of the things they sell, even if they are not 'entirely' in charge. When Caspar was selling his tshirts he really tried to keep it to a low price without compromising with the quality, just saying it could be done if they wished to. (and yes, this is a problem with a lot of celeb merch/brands as well, and celebs get dragged for it too. There was a lot of drama over Harry Styles' tshirts)
Yes, I shouldn't have assumed what I don't know. But like, do I really have to believe youtubers secretly donate their money to charity without anyone knowing about it? (speaking in general, didn't know about zoella) I had always known about caspar's work (not exactly what he does, but I knew he was involved) I think he made a video about it once, and I thought it was for his charity work that he got to meet the Queen...?
(OT I think youtubers should always talk about charity work if they are involved with them/provide donation links if required/possible. It helps spread awareness and sets a good example to kids who follow them. - I understand that they don't want to look like they are bragging, but then there are non braggy ways to go about it too)
I agree that some youtubers work hard, specially those who care about quality content, like Lilly Singh and Colleen Ballinger (and there are others too) Lilly puts out two videos a week, and her videos are mostly sketches where she plays multiple characters, as well as hire other actors, writes a script, films in different locations, and then edits. And even her non-sketch videos are scripted and well executioned. That is what I call hard work. But YouTube and youtube culture in general? Except the very occasional video, not at all. I'm sorry but I don't see the hard work in Reading out old msn chats, Playing a Lousy Game with friends, or Tasting Japanese candy.
As for Jack, I know that it's complex and things are not black and white, but imagine how this YouTube thing must look to outsiders who are not familiar with it. To them, youtubers are people who sit in their bedroom and film one video a week just talking about random stuff, gather a 'following' of gullible kids and preteens, and gets money for it. Of course some people are going to be offended when they are equated in the same bracket as people who have an artistic ability to sell (musicians, actors, etc.) And when these people manipulate their very young and gullible audience into buying ridiculously overpriced stuff from them, media houses might consider it newsworthy.
I so agree that some people can't differentiate between 'criticism' and just being a dick, and even actual bullying at times. Some people are just
I don't think Zoe is a 'horrible person' lol but this is not the first time Zoe has been accused of selling pricey merch. do we really have to pretend that youtubers just sit around while mysterious people around them sell ridiculously overpriced merch under their names and make profit of it? Of course youtubers can control the prices of the things they sell, even if they are not 'entirely' in charge. When Caspar was selling his tshirts he really tried to keep it to a low price without compromising with the quality, just saying it could be done if they wished to. (and yes, this is a problem with a lot of celeb merch/brands as well, and celebs get dragged for it too. There was a lot of drama over Harry Styles' tshirts)
Yes, I shouldn't have assumed what I don't know. But like, do I really have to believe youtubers secretly donate their money to charity without anyone knowing about it? (speaking in general, didn't know about zoella) I had always known about caspar's work (not exactly what he does, but I knew he was involved) I think he made a video about it once, and I thought it was for his charity work that he got to meet the Queen...?
(OT I think youtubers should always talk about charity work if they are involved with them/provide donation links if required/possible. It helps spread awareness and sets a good example to kids who follow them. - I understand that they don't want to look like they are bragging, but then there are non braggy ways to go about it too)
I agree that some youtubers work hard, specially those who care about quality content, like Lilly Singh and Colleen Ballinger (and there are others too) Lilly puts out two videos a week, and her videos are mostly sketches where she plays multiple characters, as well as hire other actors, writes a script, films in different locations, and then edits. And even her non-sketch videos are scripted and well executioned. That is what I call hard work. But YouTube and youtube culture in general? Except the very occasional video, not at all. I'm sorry but I don't see the hard work in Reading out old msn chats, Playing a Lousy Game with friends, or Tasting Japanese candy.
As for Jack, I know that it's complex and things are not black and white, but imagine how this YouTube thing must look to outsiders who are not familiar with it. To them, youtubers are people who sit in their bedroom and film one video a week just talking about random stuff, gather a 'following' of gullible kids and preteens, and gets money for it. Of course some people are going to be offended when they are equated in the same bracket as people who have an artistic ability to sell (musicians, actors, etc.) And when these people manipulate their very young and gullible audience into buying ridiculously overpriced stuff from them, media houses might consider it newsworthy.
I so agree that some people can't differentiate between 'criticism' and just being a dick, and even actual bullying at times. Some people are just
- BONTBFW
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Re: Caspar Lee
lol no she's not. You clearly haven't been out in the real world, if you think she's a horrible person. She was a headliner. You think someone as big as Zoella is an opening act or side show? She made a more lowkey appearance, because she suffers from anxiety. As someone who literally had to take a semester off of school, because it got so bad I know what it's like to constantly struggle with anxiety. I know what it feels like when people get angry at you for not showing up to things, or not doing things the way they want you to even though you try your hardest, but they will just never understand. The criticism is too harsh for an overpriced calendar. Period. I don't care if you praise Caspar or not, but your comment was genuinely ridiculous and if you cant see that well..you'll figure it out sooner or later that comparing Donald Trump to Zoella makes absolutely zero sense.binlova wrote:lol zoella is literally a horrible person. Hello World selling to fans with her a headliner for their money only to know she would barely make an appearance. Selling and exploiting children is still bad. If someone uses slave labor does it make it okay if they given back 1cent to charity. He basically says that the critism of zoella is too harsh and she is only human, except everyone is only human even 'awful people'. lol seems like you are upset that people aren't praising Caspar. Feel free to have an opinion but the calander is acutally not the first time people have felt extremely exploited by zoella (or felt aht she is exploiting young fans) so you can say all you want its not the same thing, seems like zoella and caspar are just upset that they didn;'t get to hear what they wanted to hearBONTBFW wrote:You just compared Trump to youtubers....also he never said you can't complain. He literally said in the video you can voice your criticism. He just didn't express properly the part about people going overboard and becoming nasty about things that don't even warrant it. He even said if they're a horrible person (ie, trump then by all means) but are we really going to act like fucking Zoella and the rest of the youtubers are the worst? They're just not. That's just level headed thinking. Again, you just seem like someone who I think is just upset they didn't get to hear what they wanted to hear.binlova wrote:I love how open youtuvers seem to be to critisise anything they feel nessisary. Eg poor serivce, Trump (i do not support trump, but caspar has posted so many negative tweets toward him) then anythig they do get pointed out and its all, I AM ONLY HUMAN OUR COMMUNITY HAS CHANGED, she works so hard, its not our/her fault. LOLOLLL HELLO WORLD literally hello world is the face of every issue they say isn’t their fault. They take money do 20% of whats promised then cry when anyone complains. I used to have so much resepect for caspar but its gone
You still compared Zoella to Trump though. Even then Caspar never said you can't complain about things. It's more that people really need to understand there's level to this shit lol. People went 100% full force on Zoe over a damn calendar, when it didn't need that at all.binlova wrote:I am not saying youtubers are the worst people in history I am saying that they are not exempt from criticism and seem to be happy to point out other peoples flaws in other industries
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Re: Caspar Lee
Lol I think did explain it better. I agree Caspar rambled too much, and the video was too short. He should have wrote out his points and other details. If you didn't have a lot of this stuff in mind already, it could be hard to understand the point he's trying to make.Riz wrote:Honestly BONTBFW, you explained 'their side of things' better than Caspar did. His video was basically this vague rant about 'positivity, positivity, I know Zoe personally and I think she's great so you shouldn't say bad things about her merch because it's not nice, media doesn't get youtube, put yourselfves in our shoes, people change, more positivity.' without actually addressing anything in particular. Yes, it's not what I wanted to hear, it's basically just another version of the same 'Mainstream media and the rest of the world doesn't get that youtube is the new ReALiTy' that I've been hearing since 2014.
I don't think Zoe is a 'horrible person' lol but this is not the first time Zoe has been accused of selling pricey merch. do we really have to pretend that youtubers just sit around while mysterious people around them sell ridiculously overpriced merch under their names and make profit of it? Of course youtubers can control the prices of the things they sell, even if they are not 'entirely' in charge. When Caspar was selling his tshirts he really tried to keep it to a low price without compromising with the quality, just saying it could be done if they wished to. (and yes, this is a problem with a lot of celeb merch/brands as well, and celebs get dragged for it too. There was a lot of drama over Harry Styles' tshirts)
Yes, I shouldn't have assumed what I don't know. But like, do I really have to believe youtubers secretly donate their money to charity without anyone knowing about it? (speaking in general, didn't know about zoella) I had always known about caspar's work (not exactly what he does, but I knew he was involved) I think he made a video about it once, and I thought it was for his charity work that he got to meet the Queen...?
(OT I think youtubers should always talk about charity work if they are involved with them/provide donation links if required/possible. It helps spread awareness and sets a good example to kids who follow them. - I understand that they don't want to look like they are bragging, but then there are non braggy ways to go about it too)
I agree that some youtubers work hard, specially those who care about quality content, like Lilly Singh and Colleen Ballinger (and there are others too) Lilly puts out two videos a week, and her videos are mostly sketches where she plays multiple characters, as well as hire other actors, writes a script, films in different locations, and then edits. And even her non-sketch videos are scripted and well executioned. That is what I call hard work. But YouTube and youtube culture in general? Except the very occasional video, not at all. I'm sorry but I don't see the hard work in Reading out old msn chats, Playing a Lousy Game with friends, or Tasting Japanese candy.
As for Jack, I know that it's complex and things are not black and white, but imagine how this YouTube thing must look to outsiders who are not familiar with it. To them, youtubers are people who sit in their bedroom and film one video a week just talking about random stuff, gather a 'following' of gullible kids and preteens, and gets money for it. Of course some people are going to be offended when they are equated in the same bracket as people who have an artistic ability to sell (musicians, actors, etc.) And when these people manipulate their very young and gullible audience into buying ridiculously overpriced stuff from them, media houses might consider it newsworthy.
I so agree that some people can't differentiate between 'criticism' and just being a dick, and even actual bullying at times. Some people are just
I just think youtubers get more shit for the same things others of their caliber do. Harry got shit for his t-shirts from the media, mainly because he was selling extra for larger sized t-shirts. Most times with mainstream celebrities fans usually complain about the prices, but the media usually don't pick up on it. With celebs who put their names on these things, attend the same meetings about these things, are literally directors in companies controlling their merch - "Oh it's their management!". For some reason with youtubers, they're always fully to blame? Why? I personally think a lot of people don't like change, and they don't like that youtubers and ~influencers are the new celebs, so they tear them down quicker.
Zoe definitely made a mistake with that calendar pricing, but I just don't for a second believe she would've priced it at that if this was 100% on her own. I think if she was on her own, she would've made a standard calendar at the pricing of others she's seen when she grew up. Just like other celebrities with overpriced things, their management whose biggest interest is making as much money as possible (I mean can't fault them entirely, it's their job. They just need to be smart about it) has a huge influence on these pricing decisions.
As for charity. Caspar has shown us physically what he's done for charity, but never what he's done from his own pockets. I personally think most youtubers making good money probably donate to charity anyway. It lowers your taxes, and it's for a good cause lol.
That is how most outsiders see youtubers, but Jack exploits this way of thinking when we all know it's not the truth. If he does become big, this whole gimmick is going to bite him in the ass and you'll see comments saying "he's become one of them".
Zoe definitely needed to be called out about the calendar, but people just took it too far for me. I just can't hop on that train.
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Re: Caspar Lee
I don't know, I feel like there is a difference between youtubers and other celebrities. Celebrities sell a lot of things—some sell music, some sell character roles/acting, some sell beauty "goals." What do youtubers (particularly vloggers) sell? Themselves. They sell the (if not false, certainly not completely true) image of themselves as the perky friendly/quirky/nerdy/etc. but attractive girl/boy next door who is your friend and BFF. They sell the illusion of friendship and closeness.BONTBFW wrote: I just think youtubers get more shit for the same things others of their caliber do. Harry got shit for his t-shirts from the media, mainly because he was selling extra for larger sized t-shirts. Most times with mainstream celebrities fans usually complain about the prices, but the media usually don't pick up on it. With celebs who put their names on these things, attend the same meetings about these things, are literally directors in companies controlling their merch - "Oh it's their management!". For some reason with youtubers, they're always fully to blame? Why? I personally think a lot of people don't like change, and they don't like that youtubers and ~influencers are the new celebs, so they tear them down quicker.
Zoe definitely made a mistake with that calendar pricing, but I just don't for a second believe she would've priced it at that if this was 100% on her own. I think if she was on her own, she would've made a standard calendar at the pricing of others she's seen when she grew up. Just like other celebrities with overpriced things, their management whose biggest interest is making as much money as possible (I mean can't fault them entirely, it's their job. They just need to be smart about it) has a huge influence on these pricing decisions.
Zoe definitely needed to be called out about the calendar, but people just took it too far for me. I just can't hop on that train.
Should celebrities screw over their fans with over priced merch? Obviously they shouldn't, it's a dick move. But isn't it way worse when people who act like their fans' BFF do it? "I love my fans so much," "the merch is for you guys" they say, constantly giving off the impression of being fans' friends, and then treat them like little ATM machines who whine until their parents dispense money. Zoe's crappy advent calendar is just so ridiculous, and it isn't the first time she's put out this type of money-grubbing product (the disastrous Hello World and the lazy PB x SL merch to name the recents), so it's increasingly difficult to give her/them the benefit of doubt.
Sorry Caspar, I don't give a damn how well you know Zoe and how sweet she is in life and how positive you think everyone should be when ya'll sit on mountains of cash siphoned from children and their hassled parents—if she keeps doing crappy things, I'm going to start calling her a crappy person. One's a chance, two's a coincidence, three times is a pattern man.
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Re: Caspar Lee
its weird people say, if they were just celebrities then they wouldn't be criticised but people criticise youtubers more.
Personally I think celebrities are criticised for everything and don't seem to be able to use the whole 'this thing wasn't a big platform that would make me this famous when I started' that a lot of youtubers use. stating that they didn't know and are only regular people. Well regular people don't make millions off fan bases, so it seems like they are just celebrities that can't take the heat. So they are happy to take your money to line up and meet them but they aren't celebrities
Personally I think celebrities are criticised for everything and don't seem to be able to use the whole 'this thing wasn't a big platform that would make me this famous when I started' that a lot of youtubers use. stating that they didn't know and are only regular people. Well regular people don't make millions off fan bases, so it seems like they are just celebrities that can't take the heat. So they are happy to take your money to line up and meet them but they aren't celebrities
- BONTBFW
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Re: Caspar Lee
Youtubers are a form of entertainment, just like someone on a TV show is. Every celebrity and youtuber sells themselves. They all have a brand. One of the most popular brands with celebrities is "I'm just a normal person", especially among celebrities aimed at teens. This isn't some brand new strategy. Yet again though, youtubers get more shit for it. I think youtubers and mainstream celebrities connect more than people would like to admit imo.pseudonyme wrote:I don't know, I feel like there is a difference between youtubers and other celebrities. Celebrities sell a lot of things—some sell music, some sell character roles/acting, some sell beauty "goals." What do youtubers (particularly vloggers) sell? Themselves. They sell the (if not false, certainly not completely true) image of themselves as the perky friendly/quirky/nerdy/etc. but attractive girl/boy next door who is your friend and BFF. They sell the illusion of friendship and closeness.BONTBFW wrote: I just think youtubers get more shit for the same things others of their caliber do. Harry got shit for his t-shirts from the media, mainly because he was selling extra for larger sized t-shirts. Most times with mainstream celebrities fans usually complain about the prices, but the media usually don't pick up on it. With celebs who put their names on these things, attend the same meetings about these things, are literally directors in companies controlling their merch - "Oh it's their management!". For some reason with youtubers, they're always fully to blame? Why? I personally think a lot of people don't like change, and they don't like that youtubers and ~influencers are the new celebs, so they tear them down quicker.
Zoe definitely made a mistake with that calendar pricing, but I just don't for a second believe she would've priced it at that if this was 100% on her own. I think if she was on her own, she would've made a standard calendar at the pricing of others she's seen when she grew up. Just like other celebrities with overpriced things, their management whose biggest interest is making as much money as possible (I mean can't fault them entirely, it's their job. They just need to be smart about it) has a huge influence on these pricing decisions.
Zoe definitely needed to be called out about the calendar, but people just took it too far for me. I just can't hop on that train.
Should celebrities screw over their fans with over priced merch? Obviously they shouldn't, it's a dick move. But isn't it way worse when people who act like their fans' BFF do it? "I love my fans so much," "the merch is for you guys" they say, constantly giving off the impression of being fans' friends, and then treat them like little ATM machines who whine until their parents dispense money. Zoe's crappy advent calendar is just so ridiculous, and it isn't the first time she's put out this type of money-grubbing product (the disastrous Hello World and the lazy PB x SL merch to name the recents), so it's increasingly difficult to give her/them the benefit of doubt.
Sorry Caspar, I don't give a damn how well you know Zoe and how sweet she is in life and how positive you think everyone should be when ya'll sit on mountains of cash siphoned from children and their hassled parents—if she keeps doing crappy things, I'm going to start calling her a crappy person. One's a chance, two's a coincidence, three times is a pattern man.
Re: Caspar Lee
But they aren't normal people... celebrities are selling an image of themselves in film, movies, television shows... they are playing a role and people become attached to the person playing said role, but that is a fantasy. The cast members of Stranger Things aren't their characters, and they don't advertise to people that this is who they are, so no offense, but there IS a huge layer between YouTubers and celebrities. YouTubers are in more intimate settings and create a persona that wants to be your friend but advertises it as real. Do you really think Zoella puts on that phony act of being bubbly and kind because she knows her fans realize it's fake? Of course not... she uses their one-sided friendship to sell them things because they feel that it will make her like them, especially when they tweet pictures of themselves buying her stuff.BONTBFW wrote:Youtubers are a form of entertainment, just like someone on a TV show is. Every celebrity and youtuber sells themselves. They all have a brand. One of the most popular brands with celebrities is "I'm just a normal person", especially among celebrities aimed at teens. This isn't some brand new strategy. Yet again though, youtubers get more shit for it. I think youtubers and mainstream celebrities connect more than people would like to admit imo.pseudonyme wrote:I don't know, I feel like there is a difference between youtubers and other celebrities. Celebrities sell a lot of things—some sell music, some sell character roles/acting, some sell beauty "goals." What do youtubers (particularly vloggers) sell? Themselves. They sell the (if not false, certainly not completely true) image of themselves as the perky friendly/quirky/nerdy/etc. but attractive girl/boy next door who is your friend and BFF. They sell the illusion of friendship and closeness.BONTBFW wrote: I just think youtubers get more shit for the same things others of their caliber do. Harry got shit for his t-shirts from the media, mainly because he was selling extra for larger sized t-shirts. Most times with mainstream celebrities fans usually complain about the prices, but the media usually don't pick up on it. With celebs who put their names on these things, attend the same meetings about these things, are literally directors in companies controlling their merch - "Oh it's their management!". For some reason with youtubers, they're always fully to blame? Why? I personally think a lot of people don't like change, and they don't like that youtubers and ~influencers are the new celebs, so they tear them down quicker.
Zoe definitely made a mistake with that calendar pricing, but I just don't for a second believe she would've priced it at that if this was 100% on her own. I think if she was on her own, she would've made a standard calendar at the pricing of others she's seen when she grew up. Just like other celebrities with overpriced things, their management whose biggest interest is making as much money as possible (I mean can't fault them entirely, it's their job. They just need to be smart about it) has a huge influence on these pricing decisions.
Zoe definitely needed to be called out about the calendar, but people just took it too far for me. I just can't hop on that train.
Should celebrities screw over their fans with over priced merch? Obviously they shouldn't, it's a dick move. But isn't it way worse when people who act like their fans' BFF do it? "I love my fans so much," "the merch is for you guys" they say, constantly giving off the impression of being fans' friends, and then treat them like little ATM machines who whine until their parents dispense money. Zoe's crappy advent calendar is just so ridiculous, and it isn't the first time she's put out this type of money-grubbing product (the disastrous Hello World and the lazy PB x SL merch to name the recents), so it's increasingly difficult to give her/them the benefit of doubt.
Sorry Caspar, I don't give a damn how well you know Zoe and how sweet she is in life and how positive you think everyone should be when ya'll sit on mountains of cash siphoned from children and their hassled parents—if she keeps doing crappy things, I'm going to start calling her a crappy person. One's a chance, two's a coincidence, three times is a pattern man.
So yes, celebrities have a brand, but by far and large, their brand is not selling themselves in the same way that YouTubers do, especially since -- hello? Celebrities have OLDER demographics that will buy good products and will discern between overpriced crap and genuinely good products (i.e. Jessica Alba's Honest Company empire) whereas YouTubers have overwhelmingly younger fanbases that will still buy crap because it's from their favorites. So YouTubers not only deserve more shit for it, but they actually get less shit because YouTube is still this isolated little world from the mainstream whereas celebrities can have their names plastered all over the world in minutes and on the news.
I'd say reality TV stars and YouTubers have more in common. But your Zoellas and your Jennifer Lawrences? No
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Re: Caspar Lee
Caspar should never lend his opinion on a controversial topic ever unless he's willing to do research and put together strong valid arguments. His defending of Zoe was all over the place, very weak with so many holes, it's a wonder why he posted it. For views most likely but I can tell he was never one who is good at debate unlike Josh. And why does he have so much spit gathered at the corner of his mouth when he talks, gross.
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Re: Caspar Lee
I said especially among celebrities aimed at teens. Yes youtubers are more intimate, but it's really not that much different. The go to way to sell things to teens and younger is that "we're just like you" "we have a relationship with our fans" approach. Youtubers didn't just randomly sprout this branding. The only thing different is youtubers are more accessible.JuniperJones wrote:But they aren't normal people... celebrities are selling an image of themselves in film, movies, television shows... they are playing a role and people become attached to the person playing said role, but that is a fantasy. The cast members of Stranger Things aren't their characters, and they don't advertise to people that this is who they are, so no offense, but there IS a huge layer between YouTubers and celebrities. YouTubers are in more intimate settings and create a persona that wants to be your friend but advertises it as real. Do you really think Zoella puts on that phony act of being bubbly and kind because she knows her fans realize it's fake? Of course not... she uses their one-sided friendship to sell them things because they feel that it will make her like them, especially when they tweet pictures of themselves buying her stuff.BONTBFW wrote:Youtubers are a form of entertainment, just like someone on a TV show is. Every celebrity and youtuber sells themselves. They all have a brand. One of the most popular brands with celebrities is "I'm just a normal person", especially among celebrities aimed at teens. This isn't some brand new strategy. Yet again though, youtubers get more shit for it. I think youtubers and mainstream celebrities connect more than people would like to admit imo.pseudonyme wrote:I don't know, I feel like there is a difference between youtubers and other celebrities. Celebrities sell a lot of things—some sell music, some sell character roles/acting, some sell beauty "goals." What do youtubers (particularly vloggers) sell? Themselves. They sell the (if not false, certainly not completely true) image of themselves as the perky friendly/quirky/nerdy/etc. but attractive girl/boy next door who is your friend and BFF. They sell the illusion of friendship and closeness.BONTBFW wrote: I just think youtubers get more shit for the same things others of their caliber do. Harry got shit for his t-shirts from the media, mainly because he was selling extra for larger sized t-shirts. Most times with mainstream celebrities fans usually complain about the prices, but the media usually don't pick up on it. With celebs who put their names on these things, attend the same meetings about these things, are literally directors in companies controlling their merch - "Oh it's their management!". For some reason with youtubers, they're always fully to blame? Why? I personally think a lot of people don't like change, and they don't like that youtubers and ~influencers are the new celebs, so they tear them down quicker.
Zoe definitely made a mistake with that calendar pricing, but I just don't for a second believe she would've priced it at that if this was 100% on her own. I think if she was on her own, she would've made a standard calendar at the pricing of others she's seen when she grew up. Just like other celebrities with overpriced things, their management whose biggest interest is making as much money as possible (I mean can't fault them entirely, it's their job. They just need to be smart about it) has a huge influence on these pricing decisions.
Zoe definitely needed to be called out about the calendar, but people just took it too far for me. I just can't hop on that train.
Should celebrities screw over their fans with over priced merch? Obviously they shouldn't, it's a dick move. But isn't it way worse when people who act like their fans' BFF do it? "I love my fans so much," "the merch is for you guys" they say, constantly giving off the impression of being fans' friends, and then treat them like little ATM machines who whine until their parents dispense money. Zoe's crappy advent calendar is just so ridiculous, and it isn't the first time she's put out this type of money-grubbing product (the disastrous Hello World and the lazy PB x SL merch to name the recents), so it's increasingly difficult to give her/them the benefit of doubt.
Sorry Caspar, I don't give a damn how well you know Zoe and how sweet she is in life and how positive you think everyone should be when ya'll sit on mountains of cash siphoned from children and their hassled parents—if she keeps doing crappy things, I'm going to start calling her a crappy person. One's a chance, two's a coincidence, three times is a pattern man.
So yes, celebrities have a brand, but by far and large, their brand is not selling themselves in the same way that YouTubers do, especially since -- hello? Celebrities have OLDER demographics that will buy good products and will discern between overpriced crap and genuinely good products (i.e. Jessica Alba's Honest Company empire) whereas YouTubers have overwhelmingly younger fanbases that will still buy crap because it's from their favorites. So YouTubers not only deserve more shit for it, but they actually get less shit because YouTube is still this isolated little world from the mainstream whereas celebrities can have their names plastered all over the world in minutes and on the news.
I'd say reality TV stars and YouTubers have more in common. But your Zoellas and your Jennifer Lawrences? No
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Re: Caspar Lee
i agree, how would you know that whatever personality a celebrity or singer shows on a camera is their true personality? jennifer lawrence is 'known' to be quirky, and relatable to many people, but how would you know if she isn't faking it? no offence, i do love her. but it's just funny how people thinks most youtubers are faking an image but they dont doubt celebrities' images? most celebrities fake a good image to gain more fans but many of them get whine up in scandals and shit too. don't singers and celebrities say things like "i love my fans" too?BONTBFW wrote:I said especially among celebrities aimed at teens. Yes youtubers are more intimate, but it's really not that much different. The go to way to sell things to teens and younger is that "we're just like you" "we have a relationship with our fans" tactic.JuniperJones wrote:But they aren't normal people... celebrities are selling an image of themselves in film, movies, television shows... they are playing a role and people become attached to the person playing said role, but that is a fantasy. The cast members of Stranger Things aren't their characters, and they don't advertise to people that this is who they are, so no offense, but there IS a huge layer between YouTubers and celebrities. YouTubers are in more intimate settings and create a persona that wants to be your friend but advertises it as real. Do you really think Zoella puts on that phony act of being bubbly and kind because she knows her fans realize it's fake? Of course not... she uses their one-sided friendship to sell them things because they feel that it will make her like them, especially when they tweet pictures of themselves buying her stuff.BONTBFW wrote:Youtubers are a form of entertainment, just like someone on a TV show is. Every celebrity and youtuber sells themselves. They all have a brand. One of the most popular brands with celebrities is "I'm just a normal person", especially among celebrities aimed at teens. This isn't some brand new strategy. Yet again though, youtubers get more shit for it. I think youtubers and mainstream celebrities connect more than people would like to admit imo.pseudonyme wrote:I don't know, I feel like there is a difference between youtubers and other celebrities. Celebrities sell a lot of things—some sell music, some sell character roles/acting, some sell beauty "goals." What do youtubers (particularly vloggers) sell? Themselves. They sell the (if not false, certainly not completely true) image of themselves as the perky friendly/quirky/nerdy/etc. but attractive girl/boy next door who is your friend and BFF. They sell the illusion of friendship and closeness.BONTBFW wrote: I just think youtubers get more shit for the same things others of their caliber do. Harry got shit for his t-shirts from the media, mainly because he was selling extra for larger sized t-shirts. Most times with mainstream celebrities fans usually complain about the prices, but the media usually don't pick up on it. With celebs who put their names on these things, attend the same meetings about these things, are literally directors in companies controlling their merch - "Oh it's their management!". For some reason with youtubers, they're always fully to blame? Why? I personally think a lot of people don't like change, and they don't like that youtubers and ~influencers are the new celebs, so they tear them down quicker.
Zoe definitely made a mistake with that calendar pricing, but I just don't for a second believe she would've priced it at that if this was 100% on her own. I think if she was on her own, she would've made a standard calendar at the pricing of others she's seen when she grew up. Just like other celebrities with overpriced things, their management whose biggest interest is making as much money as possible (I mean can't fault them entirely, it's their job. They just need to be smart about it) has a huge influence on these pricing decisions.
Zoe definitely needed to be called out about the calendar, but people just took it too far for me. I just can't hop on that train.
Should celebrities screw over their fans with over priced merch? Obviously they shouldn't, it's a dick move. But isn't it way worse when people who act like their fans' BFF do it? "I love my fans so much," "the merch is for you guys" they say, constantly giving off the impression of being fans' friends, and then treat them like little ATM machines who whine until their parents dispense money. Zoe's crappy advent calendar is just so ridiculous, and it isn't the first time she's put out this type of money-grubbing product (the disastrous Hello World and the lazy PB x SL merch to name the recents), so it's increasingly difficult to give her/them the benefit of doubt.
Sorry Caspar, I don't give a damn how well you know Zoe and how sweet she is in life and how positive you think everyone should be when ya'll sit on mountains of cash siphoned from children and their hassled parents—if she keeps doing crappy things, I'm going to start calling her a crappy person. One's a chance, two's a coincidence, three times is a pattern man.
So yes, celebrities have a brand, but by far and large, their brand is not selling themselves in the same way that YouTubers do, especially since -- hello? Celebrities have OLDER demographics that will buy good products and will discern between overpriced crap and genuinely good products (i.e. Jessica Alba's Honest Company empire) whereas YouTubers have overwhelmingly younger fanbases that will still buy crap because it's from their favorites. So YouTubers not only deserve more shit for it, but they actually get less shit because YouTube is still this isolated little world from the mainstream whereas celebrities can have their names plastered all over the world in minutes and on the news.
I'd say reality TV stars and YouTubers have more in common. But your Zoellas and your Jennifer Lawrences? No
i actually feel bad for zoe, it feels like everyone who is making a video to mock at her calendar or 'apology' is just trying to ride on the topic to gain more fans and i think that's really shallow. if you're that good in churning out good content, you dont have to pull someone down to bring yourself up. i think caspar made a few good points in his video, and if he says zoe is a nice person, idk why we have any reasons to not believe him? i wouldn't trust him if he was alfie but i dont think caspar has anything to gain by complimenting zoe.
Re: Caspar Lee
Okay, well then in the specific case of celebrities aimed towards teens, you're right. Your Kylie Jenners, your Bella Thornes (I see her name a lot but I don't know who the hell that is) do sell these images of themselves to their tween base when it's probably nothing like who they really are. But, I don't have an ounce of sympathy for Zoella or any other YouTuber that gets caught up in crap like this because they don't get to put themselves out there as these approachable friends to their fans and then pull themselves back when it gets too dicey, like overpriced calendars. I'm not buying her lack of input as it is, namely because even if she didn't set the price, she sure as hell was taking her cut of the sales, so it's not like she would have said anything if there wouldn't have been such a stink raised. I would respect it more if Gleam and its subsidiaries weren't obvious quick cash grabs that aim at just splashing the faces of their stars on merchandise made in bulk at cheap rates... as it is, for Zoe to say she spent a year on that calendar is an obvious lie.
And Jennifer Lawrence wasn't that great of an example on my end because she appeals to a wider age range... and is an Oscar winner.
And Jennifer Lawrence wasn't that great of an example on my end because she appeals to a wider age range... and is an Oscar winner.
Re: Caspar Lee
I agree that people were especially mean to zoe, but mainstream celebrities get lots of unfair hate too. people shit on bella thorne for sport. jennifer lawrence said something vaguely anti-trump, and people made up headlines about how she thinks trump caused global warming and called her terrible things. everything taylor swift does gets criticized because of a few mistakes she made years ago. someone admitted that they made up a story about gal gadot being horrible to them, but now people spread the fake story around like it's real and attack her. traditional celebrities have it just as bad as youtubers. that doesn't make it right, obviously, but i get so frustrated by this claim that they only get hate because they're youtubers.
i'm frustrated that whenever a youtuber does something wrong, they have no control over it, but when everything is going well with their brand, we're supposed to believe it's all because of them. caspar says that tons of people are employed by youtubers (which is ridiculous because as people have said, books would still be published and delivered without youtuber books. you didn't save that entire industry.), but he also says that youtubers have zero control in pricing? you're either savvy entrepreneurs or you're not.
i'm frustrated that whenever a youtuber does something wrong, they have no control over it, but when everything is going well with their brand, we're supposed to believe it's all because of them. caspar says that tons of people are employed by youtubers (which is ridiculous because as people have said, books would still be published and delivered without youtuber books. you didn't save that entire industry.), but he also says that youtubers have zero control in pricing? you're either savvy entrepreneurs or you're not.
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Re: Caspar Lee
^i agree, it's like pushing all the blames away when it's not in their favour, i just dont know why they cant admit that it's somehow zoe's fault. i honestly believe that zoe doesn't have a control in pricing because zoella beauty/lifestyle is not exactly her own company, it's her brand, but she has a management and a team, so imo she's more of an ambassador and like what she said, she's more of the ~creative~ person in the company who simply designs and picks the products. i dont think she's doing it for the money either because let's be real here, she's earning more than enough on her affiliate links and youtube alone, she can charge $5 for the calendar and it probably wouldn't make a difference to her. but i must say that the calendar was indeed crap and her response to it was even crappier. people obviously bought it because it had her name on it but all she did was push the blame to boots which imo was very irresponsible.tctp wrote:I agree that people were especially mean to zoe, but mainstream celebrities get lots of unfair hate too. people shit on bella thorne for sport. jennifer lawrence said something vaguely anti-trump, and people made up headlines about how she thinks trump caused global warming and called her terrible things. everything taylor swift does gets criticized because of a few mistakes she made years ago. someone admitted that they made up a story about gal gadot being horrible to them, but now people spread the fake story around like it's real and attack her. traditional celebrities have it just as bad as youtubers. that doesn't make it right, obviously, but i get so frustrated by this claim that they only get hate because they're youtubers.
i'm frustrated that whenever a youtuber does something wrong, they have no control over it, but when everything is going well with their brand, we're supposed to believe it's all because of them. caspar says that tons of people are employed by youtubers (which is ridiculous because as people have said, books would still be published and delivered without youtuber books. you didn't save that entire industry.), but he also says that youtubers have zero control in pricing? you're either savvy entrepreneurs or you're not.
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Re: Caspar Lee
His skin has been consistently bad recently with so much spots, and he looks tired. Earlier this year his skin was clear and he looked healthy. He should cut down on the partying, clearly it's starting to catch up to him.
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Re: Caspar Lee
interesting on his insta story to see all the people at the influener dinner?! looks like a few girls and KSI is there. Wonder who that girl he is with with brown hair is... (i like how no one really speculates about it being his girlfriend unless she is blonde)